critics :) thinStudio game project

[Lionheart008]

dear thinStudio members...

do me please a favour to discuss short about the going on at the govern game project !
End of discussing deadline I see here at sunday, 26.10.2008, 23:59 pm

a) - what's going on here with the game project forum?
it's not a ghost, that's whispering to me... I want to fill my job here with more input for the game... so I can see the timetable structure fits as well for game development...
I have perhaps the same problems as you I can imagine about the forthcoming at the game... I was out some days, holidays, now it's just another aura here ...

Our aims for this month! we can catch it, isn't it?

October 31st, 2008:

- Feature set decided
- Story and setting finished
- Track implementation done
- Track editor workable
- Dummy artwork for track and vessel for testing provided
- Particle routines done

b) - there's something going wrong with engaged work for it and the project has in my eyes very good chance to catch the aim to develop the 'govern' game, I feel that... it's a normal way of doing with ups and downs, not every day the sun is shining, but I would like to know, as michael hartlef did it some days/weeks before, should we go on ???

c) - I stop working on my projects for the game if we cannot 'discuss' what's going wrong or if we have too different directions with working at the game, content, city concepts, track tile concepts, particle and collision module and more...

d) - I am not angry, only just a little bit sad about the current come-together-here... I can spend my time with other things they doesn't belong to the game project...

e) - I don't like to throw it all away, some crisis takes time to solve, but here it's just a little problem, I see, the men-power for the thinStudio team is present, use it

f) I would like to go on with more input for the game... I know the different situation of some guys here, but I wonder why the project is tuning down... ?

g) so we are a team with positively team spirit, adult persons, we can talk about it what's the main problem or the "core" mistake, but not every day and until sunday I would like to see what happens with the game, otherwise I stop my work here.

I am still not perfect, cannot work every day at the game project, but I like this game idea and will finish it... push it ! ;D

=> timetable... I repeat it here...

November 30th, 2008

- OpenGL GUI routines done
- Dummy artwork for gui provided
- Multiplayer routines done
- First play mode playable
- SoundFX provided
- Music partially provided

December 31st, 2008

- Second play mode playable
- First play mode finished
- Artwork finished


January 27th, 2008

- Everything has to be done

January 29th, 2008

- Game packaged and send to CodingMonkeys

ps: the 'dummy badmines body' figure I add here... because I like this work at the game project and I am proud of it !

I wanted to see this object explode during playing the govern game

best regards, Frank
(Lionheart)

[Michael Clease]

I think your wasting your time this game will not get complete in time for the competition.

[Lionheart008]

dear michael
thank you for short input... that's new for me, this changing of behaviour of the members about the game project... so I am still wondering...

...and I don't agree with you, if you cannot say, why... ?

I think your wasting your time this game will not get complete in time for the competition.

- why do you think so? ... complete in time for the competition... ???
can you specific it what do you mean? We have lost time? We cannot fulfill the timetable?
stressy working in a team with various minds and characters? ... I am not wasting my time here I am sure...

=> perhaps we can manage it with the game if everybody can say what's the reason for personal resignation... it's necessary I am thinking to say what we need/wish and if it's realistic to realize our tasks in time, even with a 90 per cent man power...

I wish to hear the opinions of all thinstudio team members clear and open without personal critics to the member here... it's possible, I know such things and see always a way to open new forces, power, motivation and new doors...

@michael - hey, michael clease, what's your wish for the project at this time?

ciao und servus, lionheart

[ISAWHIM]

I am still working on code... Though I have resigned from the team, to ease tension...

My attempt to suggest standards, so we were all on the same page, or at-least on the same planet, were met with more confusion than I thought. Other than design of objects, there is little I can do beyond where I am at now. Code just can't be made to flex like a rubber-band. It needs a solid foundation to build-up on. (No foundation = no walls)

What I can do... because it does not need "Game standards", is what I am doing now. The creation of the CWAD, which will hopefully house all our data, for use in the game.

(Particles) Nearly complete, I think was the last I heard.

(Editor), can't be made without knowing sizes, and what is going to be edited. The one that was started, I can not get to hold the proposed tile-sizes, as the camera setup and mouse controls are beyond my comprehension. They don't work with the life-sized proposed tiles, and I can't get the program to handle them. If we use custom-points, as opposed to hand-assigning them, the editor which displays the track, should be used to place the track-points. (But again, I can not get it to work with the track... and so, no point edit ability.)

(Track), same/similar issue... just delayed.

(AI), can't get any more developed without the ability to collide (Into the world and other players) I can fake the player collision, but without a path to follow/guide, they will flock like birds racing for the same piece of bread.

(Collision), I don't have the ability to do "World" collision, as I have no idea what the world will be. (Flat I can do, but this is desired to be a non-2d track.)

(Physics) are essentially done, minus the tweaks. They need collision to create impact forces.

(Guidance) For tracking progression through the track, is the same points as what the AI could use. Even if AI does not use points... players still need zones to detect completion of track-segments and wrong-way and cheating by going back and forth across the start point, without running the track. Camera, if not attached to the bumper, needs that same path to lag-behind and follow.

(Input) I got no reply about the complexity of controls, so I assume, make them all, and let the user decide.

(Artwork) I believe you guys are still doing that.

(Skybox) Good enough to throw-in, just waiting on art-work.

(UI) Undecided... Mike started one... Looked good, but needs artwork to progress.

(CWAD) Nearly complete enough to use, even if only as generic use. (Generic being as a ZIP which holds all our data, read only as needed, as opposed to demanding an install, or creating a complex bundle that keeps extracting and deleting the data on every launch. Even unused data.)

(Sounds) Not sure... They can be plugged-in at the last minute, if needed.

If I were to suggest an order... I would say...
- Keep playing with the "Concept Art", those same models will be used, or a likeness of, in the game.
- Once I finish with the CWAD, the important part, I will write an ugly player-collision code. (That will be replaced later.)
- UI can be done with generic art, and no game. We know what we want it to get to, it just has to go there.
- Track... make a final decision... does it have only a track, or background objects related to the city it is in. (If not in the city, and just the race is FOR the city. Then we can just use sky-box drop-art. Not a problem.
- Points, I can't think of a way to do this without them, AI aside... They need development, but hand-placed will work for now.
- Player-Editor... To me, not a high priority, but for us to make all these tracks... it is a high priority. (That will be a lot of hand placement that will drive me mad.)

Deadline... Before the contest.

We can finish the glitter and glow after the contest. For the contest, it only has to function, and display our programming ability.

It is not "My Game"... There is nothing here that is mine, except the air-friction and velocity code that I modified in Petr's sample code. (The suggestion of the CORE... but the CORE is just the shell that holds the game, and is only things found in the help-files and in the demo-projects, which is NOT my code. :P)

I say we finish what we started.

You tell me what you want... since people don't like the way I ask.

:-X I have taken a vow of silence... Since this is now an "Open development".

[Lionheart008]

hey, thank you very much, jason !

Short reply:

=> @isawhim - What's your personal wish for the game project? - More do you like working together? do you need a closer partner here with coding works or building/creating things? - Say it... two, three sentence, not more...

- Such things I am looking for, it's just a question of good manner/behaviour to get a better motivation for the team ...

I have understood, what do you mean you have a lot of good ideas...
no work here will be done useless...

If I were to suggest an order... I would say...
- Keep playing with the "Concept Art", those same models will be used, or a likeness of, in the game.
- Once I finish with the CWAD, the important part, I will write an ugly player-collision code. (That will be replaced later.)
- UI can be done with generic art, and no game. We know what we want it to get to, it just has to go there.
- Track... make a final decision... does it have only a track, or background objects related to the city it is in. (If not in the city, and just the race is FOR the city. Then we can just use sky-box drop-art. Not a problem.
- Points, I can't think of a way to do this without them, AI aside... They need development, but hand-placed will work for now.
- Player-Editor... To me, not a high priority, but for us to make all these tracks... it is a high priority. (That will be a lot of hand placement that will drive me mad.)

good to hear that, we can talk about the task/possibilities with petr, eros, michael, kent, abraxas (michael), simone, charles and all other, new members here... of course...

in a friendly kind: must laugh, jason, 'a vow of silence', we are not in an monastery, that's rubbish (sorry!), we must talk!!! ;D

go for gold and run to the sun ! you are on the right way! I will check your CWAD...

...and I like your city concepts/track lines !

lionheart

ps: I have no problems at all with the 'open development' to see it for all registered thinbasic users ...

[kryton9]

This was a big project with many objectives to do in a short time. All were good ideas and easy to see why they were there as it fit the project. But things happen and for a remote group of team members from all over the world to do such a project in short time, it was just too difficult in the time we had.

Not enough is in place to do "ambitious games" at the moment with thinBasic and tbgl, in my opinion. Both are progressing at light speed and I think in short time many pieces will be in place, just not in time for this competition. What I mean by ambitious games is commercial level games that have come out in the last few years. More than enough is in place to make great games that would compare well with games made prior to 1995 and easily any games made in the 1980's in my opinion.

Everything that has been discussed and created is still there as we also had stuff for topdown fps game. When the time is right we can do these projects then.

[Charles Pegge]

I would think in terms of years rather than months - have less pressure and produce well crafted modules that can be deployed in any number of games / simulation / design software. We are not under any commercial deadlines - so there is no need to force the pace and compromise on quality - or make the coding experience stressful.

I was particularly excited by the idea of developing virtual cities - but to do this well, it's going to take many months.

[Petr Schreiber]

Hi,

I think it is growing too fast, we go in too many directions.
This way we will not be able to finish the project in time.

From my side I will have more time to code during the week which is coming.

I agree with Charles it might be more efficient to slowdown and produce well thought solutions rather than quickdone modules. This goes a bit against the target of finishing game for competition based on new "technologies".

I am not sure we can make it, as project has very blurry contours. We have too much ideas for track implementation for example.

On other side I appreciate Jasons wild experiments from general point of view.
Just not convinced we can make this in time for the game.

It sounds terrible, it would mean incredible loss of work, but sometimes I think if it would not be better to come with basic concept ( kind of "casual" game ), with strict and simple rules, coded beautifuly using current resources we have.

That was my cup of pesimism for today


Petr

[matthew]

...It sounds terrible, it would mean incredible loss of work, but sometimes I think if it would not be better to come with basic concept ( kind of "casual" game ), with strict and simple rules, coded beautifuly using current resources we have...

You're right, games like [wiki=Tempest_2000]Tempest 2000[/wiki] & Geometry Wars are really simple but they're extremely playable.