Lytro: Focus-Free Camera

[ErosOlmi]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=7babcK2GH3I

http://mashable.com/2011/10/19/lytro-closer-look/#30569Lined-up

http://mashable.com/2011/06/22/lytro-interactive-gallery/

[Petr Schreiber]

I watch news about this technology for some time, it looks very promising. Now as the device design is out, I don't understand:

How do I control aperture/time/iso (and if at all - the website says "The aperture is constant across the zoom range allowing for unheard of light capture. " - does it mean constant f number for zoom 1x to 8x, how? Impossible :D?)
How do I control zoom (it has zoom, please see here: https://www.lytro.com/science_inside)
How do I browse/delete images

It is strange, because I can't see any buttons, except one on the top, which is probably photoshoot button.


Petr

[Petr Schreiber]

Here few more info bits:

Press release: http://www.dpreview.com/news/1110/11101930lytrocameraannounced.asp
Interview: http://www.dpreview.com/articles/7237351494/lytro-light-field-camera-first-look-with-ren-ng

It answers few of my questions:


...in which you'll find the camera's three physical controls - the power switch, a shutter button and a slider that you stroke to zoom the lens in and out.
All other interaction with the camera is conducted via the small, 128x128 pixel square touch screen that covers the rear face of the device.



Petr

[Petr Schreiber]

Here you can see the device in action:
http://nofilmschool.com/2011/10/crazy-4d-camera-399-reality-lytro-sale/

It is quite interesting to see, because it reveals few things not evident from the press release, for example:

When you take a photo, there is no wait for AF to focus, it is instant
You can view the photos on the device screen, including the postprocess refocus operations

Petr

[dcromley]

For me, the obvious question is "What file format does it use?" *.jpg won't be useful.
(I am skeptical)

[Petr Schreiber]

Hi,

I think it uses their own format, because it needs to store different kind of information than just single frame pixel matrix. From the info on their website I calculated single shot is about 24 MB in size.
I guess publishing single "cut" (with given focus) to other file formats will be possible.

This device is evidentely not targeted yet at "serious" photographers, but I keep my fingers crossed for them - I know how hard it is to push some new concept to industry ready state, so I hope this intermediate step will help them get funds for something with more manual control/resolution/...

I can see already great use for this device in reportage photography, where you might not have time to think where to focus. The fact you press the button and get the image is ideal for this.


Petr

[José Roca]

I can see already great use for this device in reportage photography, where you might not have time to think where to focus. The fact you press the button and get the image is ideal for this.


I don't think so. Using a wide angle lens and zone focus, you never miss a shot.

[Petr Schreiber]

It is true José,

but still, I don't think it rules the Lytro out completely. I remember some situations, for example quite recently wedding of my very good friend, where I got into situation when my ability to prepare zone focusing failed. Well, for the most part it is because I am not really good at taking photos :oops:, but still...

I also like (as lot of beginners) to work with very thin depth of field, and in such a case it is very easy to miss the target, unless you focus on the center all the time.

I don't say the Lytro is something which will change the way we take photos, but I like the alternative approach and can imagine it to be a good helper in some situations.


Petr

[dcromley]

Remember the "Frazier Lens"? It featured a "massive" depth-of-field.
A 3.5 min video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=06t8TGAffNA

However, it was determined to be a hoax:
http://forums.randi.org/archive/index.php/t-4335.html

From https://www.lytro.com/science_inside
> Capturing the Light Field -- Recording light fields requires an innovative,
> entirely new kind of sensor called a light field sensor. The light field sensor
> captures the color, intensity and vector direction of the rays of light.

So am I to believe that this information from the light field sensor, including
"vector direction", is digitized? I doubt it.

I predict it will be a package using "Focus Stacking", a believable technology
using a number of conventional images at various focus settings. Then these
images can be combined in various ways.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Focus_stacking
http://www.heliconsoft.com/video.html ($30-$250)

Very interesting.

[José Roca]

No doubt they will find applications to this technology, but "revolutionize photography"?

This article shares some of my doubts: http://techcrunch.com/2011/07/22/doubts-about-lytros-focus-later-camera/

My first serious camera was a Canon F-1. I bought a second hand body in 1975 and still works as new. As I was eagle-eyed, I used a matte focusing screen, without distracting focusing aids, and never got an out of focus picture. Zone focusing was dead easy with the lenses available for these professional mechanical cameras because they had depth of field marks in the barrel. I used color slides for macro photography and landscapes, and black and white for portraits and other subjects.

The first digital camera that has caught my attention is the Fuji X100. Looks a lot like the old Leica rangefinder cameras. See: http://www.kenrockwell.com/fuji/x100.htm

[Petr Schreiber]

No doubt they will find applications to this technology, but "revolutionize photography"?
Hehe, that is the classic example of "marketing english, lesson 1", I learned to filter this out.

Fuji X100 is beautiful piece, but a little bit costy for poor mortals :) Some people report problems with initial firmware, but update should be out already:
http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/FujifilmX100/

I like Fuji cameras, I had a very nice time with Fuji 6500FD, which I passed to my brother last month. Quite emotional bye bye, but endorphines got back to normal level thanks to my father, which passed me Nikon D80 at disposal currently. It is camera which kicked me back to really enjoy taking photos.


Petr

[Petr Schreiber]

Finished reading the article José posted, very good analysis.

As I wrote earlier, I think the developement team behind this didn't mean the currently offered Lytro camera as the ultimate device, but they need to get funds somehow to continue their work and at the same time they need to show "we can do it". The marketing department of course uses all the weapons to persuade others this is revolution, which is quite common concept in tech business I am afraid.

From my side, I didn't have my expectations high when the first rumours about the device appeared, especially once they declared clearly that the first piece coming out of the factory is more targeted at "facebook people", which want to take photos and present them in entertaining way (which interactive refocusing applet is). But in my opinion this targeting makes sense from busines point of view, because simple control has bigger potential to attract wider audience = more funds for further developement, manufactoring, ...

As a first step in new direction, and with the price not that extremely high for new concept... I still consider it solid attempt from what I have read.
Seeing the device "live" would be best to make an opinion about usability of course.

Seeing the target group, absence of manual control... I think it is not meant (yet) for more advanced/technical users, so it is a bit hard to directly compare it to advanced compact or even mirror cameras.


Petr

[Petr Schreiber]

The first review of Lytro is available:
http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/lytro/

Some interesting information - for example the resolution is in the end 1080x1080.


Petr