Does your future end at the cemetery?

[danbaron]

This guy will be on our radio show tonight.

http://www.paradigm-sys.com/index.cfm

(http://www.paradigm-sys.com/index.cfm)

[Charles Pegge]

Excellent speaker and debunker of scientism.

Charles Tart - Consciousness and Survival 1 of 6


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zRK3LD-Mts0

[John Spikowski]

Does your future end at the cemetery?

Only if you're not in the stock market. Blood bath today. :(

[Charles Pegge]

http://www.montaguekeen.com/page230.html


(http://www.montaguekeen.com/page230.html)

[danbaron]

(Not much time now.)

I'm downloading the interview.

In the meantime, this guy (Matthew Alper) was on our radio show last night.

http://www.godpart.com/

http://www.godpart.com/html/the_premise.html

He seems like a decent guy, not a fanatic.

But anyway, he came up with the "revelation" that the reason the vast majority of people are religious/spiritual is because there is a part of the human brain which causes such beliefs. He said that humans are the only species which is self-aware (I think my dogs and cats might disagree). Humans are the only species which knows that life always ends in death (I guess this is true). In order to deal with this terrifying knowledge, natural selection modified the human brain so that humans would delude themselves into believing that death is not the end of existence - our existence is independent of our bodies.

I didn't listen to the whole show. I guess he meant that for some reason associated with maximizing the likelihood of survival, humans developed a great intellectual capacity. The downside was that they then also realized the fact of death. Since humans were also so psychologically developed, so socialized, so uncomfortable with the loss of relationships, including their relationships to themselves, death could cause them to lose all motivation to continue trying to survive. If they lost that motivation, then, they would be unable or unwilling to have and raise offspring until the offspring were capable of continuing the chain. Humans were smart enough to figure out that their only actual purpose was to send their genes into the future. This realization was impossible to tolerate, so, natural selection produced the "God" deception (I have to admit, that as I write this from what I think is Alper's point of view, I am depressing myself - the argument always seems to make bleak sense to me.).

But, apparently, nature was not clever enough. The more intelligent humans were able to see through the deception. They realized that life has no objective meaning, all meaning is subjective. They were courageous enough to face this reality, and to continue with life anyway, etc.

(No more time, I have to catch the train. Maybe more depressing ideas later.)

[Charles Pegge]

Interview with Montague Keen shortly before his death in Jan 2004

http://www.montaguekeen.com/page206.html


Recordings of Montague Keen speaking from the spirit world


2004
http://www.montaguekeen.com/page73.html


16 May 2004
http://www.montaguekeen.com/page79.html


Montague Speaking to John Sampson
http://www.montaguekeen.com/page77.html


John E Mack
http://www.montaguekeen.com/page31.html
http://www.montaguekeen.com/page68.html


Sir Arthur Conan Doyle

The audio recording used in this virtual movie was made on the 14th May 1930 shortly before his death:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lllQtxfjr-o

In Spirit

http://www.montaguekeen.com/page76.html




http://www.newsmonster.co.uk/paranormal-unexplained/has-montague-keen-really-returned-from-the-dead-2.html

[danbaron]

I watched Conan Doyle.

I read the links connected to text articles.

I listened to the interview with Veronica Keen.

There are some hopeful things.

There are also some things which skeptics would pounce on.

Montague Keen and John Mack died in 2004. There were initial claims of communications with them, and promises of many more in the future - but my impression is that the promises have not been fulfilled.

Veronica Keen said that at one event, Montague Keen materialized, spoke to the audience, and was shaking hands with people. However, she also said there were no cameras there.

Veronica Keen said that Montague Keen insisted to her that Earth will undergo a pole shift. Do you think that is likely during our lifetimes?

Veronica Keen claims that Montague Keen basically, channels through her by automatic writing. Who would claim that automatic writing can be demonstrated to come from outside of the person holding the pen?

[Charles Pegge]

I did an in-depth search on Google and found 4 very brief references to John Mack in the Montague messages:

21 Mar 2010
18 July 2010
5 Sept 2010
20 Mar 2011

We must wait and see if anything substantive follows.

I also came across an interesting article which may serve to illustrate how the media is manipulated to discredit by selective editing. (It's risky to try it with a live audience.)

Lawyers on the Skeptics


http://www.victorzammit.com/skeptics/ultimatepsychiccon.html

Charles

[danbaron]

I looked at the article. I see that James Randi's birth name was, Randall James Hamilton Zwinge. If you think about what Veronica Keen said, about Montague Keen materializing in front of an audience, speaking to them, and shaking some people's hands, that is exactly the equivalent of what Jesus is supposed to have done after the Resurrection, and is the basis for the Christian religion.

Interestingly, the guy conducting the interview did not stop her at that point and specify that if what she alleged had indeed occurred, it was probably the most amazing event in at least the last two thousand years. Instead, he just monotonically (probably, I am incorrect, it should be, "monotonously", but I wanted to indicate, in a flat emotionless monotone) asked her if anyone had a camera, she said no, and then he went on to the next topic. Does that make any sense whatsoever? Does it make any sense that such an event could possibly happen without any photographs being taken?

If Montague Keen did what she said, then, it seems to me that he should be seen on the same level as Jesus. Apparently, to everyone else, no such correlation is indicated.

I'm not saying that Jesus and Montague Keen did or did not appear as material humans after their deaths, but, intuitively, I guess I am doubting them both.

[Charles Pegge]

It would be helpful to have independent accounts from other persons who witnessed these events.

Here is a Skeptic view. (I have not studied it closely)

http://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&source=web&cd=2&sqi=2&ved=0CCcQFjAB&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.skepticreport.com%2Fsr%2F%3Fp%3D536&ei=2YxHTrC0HoOs8gPT_sW8Bg&usg=AFQjCNHBtrOI6SuOkLoYtdJhQxGNEjfkVQ&sig2=Ic60IX84Qsd4frRXRXm-Gg

Charles

[danbaron]

I looked quick now, am tired.

Nothing about the tribute, which, if I am correct, is where Montague manifested.

If you think like a cop, then, the obvious reason that Montague and Mack are not sending research papers from the afterlife, is that they are not communicating from the afterlife.

If true, then, that state of affairs would make things quite difficult for any person channeling their research.

Certainly and absolutely, I don't understand people. But, of course, I am at a disadvantage since, I am the only person I have ever been.

But, for instance, concerning Veronica Keen, if she is fooling herself, then, what is the gain, her emotional survival?